Actually Awesomest JRPGs: The Voting Thread

I have made an edit to my list to remove Kingdom Hearts 2, thereby moving everything else up a slot and putting Xenoblade in the top ten. I decided that Kingdom Hearts ran counter to two of the tropes I consider necessary for a JRPG - it does not have turn-based combat, and it does not have a customizable party. Because of all the genre-blending that goes on, I can allow for one trope to be fudged, but not two. So, Kingdom Hearts is out of this list, but will show prominently whenever we decide to vote on/argue about action RPGs.

For the record, my JRPG tropes: a predetermined main character (as opposed to one that is created by the player); party members that are picked up as part of the story progression; a customizable party setup (as in, more available party members than combat slots, allowing the player to decide who fights a given battle); turn-based combat; a story that is epic in tone and/or scale, with few sandbox elements. Asymmetrical clothing and gravity-defying hair are not required, but appreciated.

Technically it does have a customizable party! But only occasionally: you can swap in a particular location's NPC (Tarzan or what not) for one of your party members while you're in their world.

...but, yeah, by that criterion, I can't honestly argue.

*goes back to using this thread as a wish-list-building resource for summer video game freedom*

See, I find this interesting, because while I can see #1, I didn't think it was hugely important; I liked FFXII for breaking away from that a little. And maybe it's just my own incompetence--or difficulty in grinding--but I thought that most JRPGs I played majorly broke #2, because I was always getting murdered in boss fights in FFX over not being able to figure out the strategy for fighting. #3 makes a lot of sense to me, though I think it gets obscured a bit by action-y RPGs that also level you up; my fights in Kingdom Hearts depend somewhat on twitching, but you're also going to get curb-stomped if you try to take them on while too low level and insufficiently skilled, but can compensate with one for the other.

*ponders*

Come to think of it, I'm so used to needing to grind viciously to make up for my terrible skills that it's rather obscured the difference between twitch skills and strategic skills for me, in how the combat is defined. I'm bad at both, so I consider them roughly equal in terms of "stuff I make up for by getting more levels before the fight." I guess the main difference is that with the terrible tactical skills, checking a walkthrough can help some; it doesn't do a damn thing for the twitch lack.

I sure as hell couldn't! I gave up without ever beating FFX because I just could not beat one of the bosses, after multiple attempts at grinding some more to be able to handle it.

This thread is fascinating to me, because I am starting to realize just how much my definition of genres is based on my own play limitations. "That's a JRPG, not an action RPG; after all, I can beat it!" seems to be part of my previously unexamined criteria.

That works, although I tend to think the better examples have a more explicitly tactical feel to how you deal with applying damage and organizing your team's actions. In any case, it perfectly describes how I play Yakuza, so I'm pleased with the definition. Environment/Gun/weapon spam to victory, and once you have a level/move edge on random encounters, then you play around with the soft fighting system.

1. Etrian Odyssey and shame on you guys who didn't include it.
2. EO II, while it had more balanced mechanics and some major quality of life improvements, it added some classes I just didn't care for.
3. EO III fuck you I can make my top three all Etrian Odyssey if I want to, and this one has a pirate ship so there.
4. Persona 4
5. Skies of Arcadia
6. Lunar
7. P3P
8. Suikoden 3
9. Final Fantasy 6
10. Atelier Iris

It also helps that I consider the action oriented JRPG titles that try to embrace positioning as a key factor as mostly failures mechanically (ie Star Ocean 3) or straying into SRPG territory. And that is probably the easiest way to force an explicitly tactical layer into your combat.

All the inclusions of Skies of Arcadia on these lists just warm my heart. I'm gonna go play it again.

Well, you ruled out ff12. But maybe you really don't think that's a jrpg.

1. Dark Cloud 2 / Dark Chronicle - I'm not sure this is the best JRPG of all time (I'm not entirely sure it's a JRPG), but nobody else voted for it, so it needs to make up points.
2. Final Fantasy 12 - Story gets dumb near the end, but it's a fun take on combat mechanics.
3. Final Fantasy 1 - I played soooo much of this when I was a kid. Favorite NES game by far.
4. Persona 3 - I was all Persona'd out after this and never played 4, but it's a solid game with cool systems and fun little character interactions.
5.Shadow Hearts: Covenant - Oops, forgot about this.
6.Pokemon - The stories are all insipid and the mechanics for the most part constantly improve with each version, but I'll go with the first one for getting the ball rolling.
7. Etrian Odyssey - I'm not sure this is a JRPG, but I don't want Angie to be mad at me.
8. Xenoblade Chronicles - It's obviously a good game, but I lost interest after about 20 hours. I keep saying I'll come back to it, but who knows.
9. Final Fantasy 7 - I know it's not cool to like this, but I was really into it at the time.
10. Dragon Quest 8 - It got grindy and I never finished, but I really liked the world and characters.
11. Unlimited SaGa - It's not a good game. In fact, it's a really bad game. But I played the Japanese version, and between barely understanding it, and a difficulty that ramps up to insane levels in the first couple hours unless you play everything perfectly, it was an interesting experience.

There are some games that could have made it, but they suffered from me discovering them at the wrong time. Final Fantasys 2, 3, and 6 I played way after they came out and couldn't get that into. I was starting to get into The World Ends With You, and then my DS disappeared.

There's no separate combat screen. It's a modified MMORPG system.

How could EO not be a JRPG?

It's a dungeon crawler. There's barely even the pretense of an RPG in it.

You might be right on a technicality, but it certainly doesn't feel like a context switch. You're pretty sure you can't cast spells if a monster isn't in range? I thought you could, but it's been a while. Offensive spells you probably need a target, yes.

Hanacker, dude, I don't want to call your opinions invalid or anything, but you lost interest after 20 hours of XC, never played P4, and you DID play Unlimited Saga (and should have known after Saga Frontier never to touch it). And come on man your list is 4/10 Final Fantasy.

Honestly that's just way too much. That's like coming into a "top ten restaurants" thread and you list Pizza Hut, Domino's, Little Caesar's, and Papa Johns.

And come on FF7 is definitely the Domino's of Final Fantasy. Everyone's eaten it, everyone knows it was a mistake and you only like it if you've never eaten pizza before in your life.

Next up: A top 10 novels thread, where Hanacker lists all Dan Brown's books, and puts DaVinci Code over Angels and Demons.

Um. Do you think I put it at #6 without playing it? I assume you'd fall under the rogue-likes are RPGs camp, then? Is FTL an RPG?

So if they got rid of the "Run away" command it wouldn't be a JRPG anymore?

I don't think you could get much closer to a real-world RPG than roguelikes do. At least Elona, Nethack, and the like. FTL could be argued to be RPG-ish with the stats and interactions, but it has too much twitch basis.

I think that's all the JRPGs I've ever played. I had more patience for RPGs 10 years ago (Persona 3 was probably the last one I've completed and it was soooo long), so more stuff from that era makes it.Oh, and Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter suffered from trying to play it in Japanese and not really understanding what was going on.

I only played Unlimited Saga because they were practically giving it away in Japan, and I only played it for a few hours. It was terrible, but memorable. I think it had good music?

Edit: And you probably wouldn't want to see my best tv shows list.

Edit2: Forgot Shadow Hearts: Covenant

Hanacker is the alexlitel of JRPGs.

I don't know, I've always included Rogue-like games into my RPG list.

And seeing how all of you seem to love Skies of Arcadia, it's clear that I'm missing out. I might go and search it up.

So Pokemon Mystery Dungeon is a JRPG? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here.

I was thinking along the lines of Izuna - the unemployed ninja.
Which I never finished because it was too hard.

But then again, that's not exactly a JRPG either, now that I think about it.

._. I liked this thread better before Charles decided it was his job to moderate/quality control it. It was fun once.

ETA:

I played Kingdom hearts myself. I did not enjoy it. I simply get really sick of hearing people say 'OMG! KINGDOM HEARS IS TEH BEST!' because it was bashed at me so much in school and I caught shit for not liking it.

I didn't like it because I didn't like it. I just become distressed hearing how good it is, because people are so adamant about it and I've had enough over the years. Same thing with FF7 really. I just cannot agree the things people point out are so damn wonderful.

Is Wizardry a JRPG?

Also, aren't the Persona games roguelikes? I've never actually played one but I'm sure I've heard that.

I like this thread better when people started bitching about other people's posts. I don't give a crap about JRPG's but I do enjoy a good forum slapfight.

EO is an RPG. It has stats, experience, skills, a party, quests, NPCs, and a narrative that the player takes part in. It's also got the J in the music and art style choices. I really don't see how it would be disqualified from being a JRPG unless you think that JRPG means cutscenes.