So in your definition, putting on one same-level item is twinking. We're not going to agree on that. Also, level 10s can drop for a level 10 character. I'm pretty sure I remember getting drops that I had to wait to use because I wasn't high enough level. Of course, I could be mistaken.
You're going to have to put some effort into defining "same-level" here. Is it something that drops at the level that your character is when you're naturally playing through the game? Is it an item which reflects the power level that the designers feel you should have in the area it drops? Saying that "same-level" means the level at which you can equip it makes absolutely no sense in the ARPG paradigm. Is Saigon's same-level for a level 6 Paladin? Do we expect Diablo II to be balanced for a sub-level-10 character with a full set of it?
Your position appears to be "Anything that a level 10 character can equip in Diablo III is same-level for a level 10 and therefore not twinking". How does that not extend to my Saigon's example, exactly?
All I see is you completely missing the point of why an item of required-level-10 has that stat on it, or a req-20, or whatever. Which is, again, to put an artificial limit, with the intent of improving gameplay, on how much you can boost your character through item-acquisition means that are not playing through the game with that character. Your position appears to be "If my level 10 can equip it, it's not twinking", with the supporting argument of "It says required level 10, so it's the same level as my character", which makes no fucking sense, but if you refer just to claim that you made some sort of point earlier in a post you don't feel like repeating, feel free.
It's theoretically possible to obtain a full set of level 10 items at level 10 by playing the game normally, but this argument has spun so far away from why the game is or isn't good it's pretty funny.
I've said that equipping a couple of level 10 items at level 10 does not constitute twinking because the game can easily drop that gear at that level. Equipping yourself with a full set of yellow/orange gear at level 10 is twinking because there's no reasonable chance that you'd get all of those drops at the same time. I've been quite specific on this and this isn't hard to understand. What part of this do you not comprehend? In that regard, given the AH in Diablo 3, is there any difference in buying level 10 gear that you can afford from the AH versus having it dropped as it pertains to twinking? Is buying a piece of cheap same-level gear twinking because it's the same level you are even when drops like that are common (notice I said common - I didn't say useful because so much gear drops that isn't useful)? --- On a tangent, I think Blizzard screwed up because they counted on people wanting to play multiplayer (and therefore swap equipment) or thinking the AH wouldn't detract from the enjoyment of the game. So they didn't bother to balance it very well. For many of us, the method by which we acquire the gear makes a substantial difference in the enjoyment of the game. The excitement is looking to see what goodies you got from killing a boss. When repeatedly nothing useful drops because the loot system is shitty, it's not only disappointing, but the game gets too difficult and going to the AH is the only way to proceed. But I didn't buy D3 to play Shopping Tycoon and for me having to do so sucks the life out of the game. It feels like admitting defeat. But there's no way to progress and nothing is fucking dropping, so you buy your new shiny nad use it reluctantly. Of course, because the difficulty level is off, the game then turns into easy & boring mode for 3-4 more levels. Those who managed to make it to a level where useful things supposedly dropped, the difficulty curve smoothed out and the game just flowed...I either envy you or pity you. Personally, I couldn't put up with slogging through the game again just to see if it ever got there. 15 hours was enough. But I digress...
Torchlight 2, because I want my games to be fun. Diablo 3 had me feel like a hamster running on a wheel. Oh please blizzard drop me something good so I can get stuck on the very next monster until I spend 5hrs on the Auction house trying to get better gear. Playing Torchlight 2 reminded me what it was like to play Diablo games. Minus the soundtrack and imagery. That's sad for Blizzard and great for Runic games. Diablo 3 seemed like a way for Blizz to start practicing how to squeeze extra money out of people. AND THAT left a bad bad taste in my mouth. Torchlight 2 is a 1/3 the price and more fun.
Yeah, that is why I hope I can return to D3 at a later date with a bit less skewed perspective on the game. My experience in Inferno largely consisted of hopping from exploit to exploit on my Demon Hunter (farming Act 2 chests, etc) because the game was so wildly imbalanced that it wasn't worth trying to progress until I'd exploited myself a ton of loot I couldn't use, AH'd it and bought stuff from people farming Act III and IV. This wasn't remotely fun and I have no idea why I did it. I believe the thinking at the time was this is Diablo 3 and I'm having fun damnit.
Well, listen to the Soundtrack again, it was straight up Diablo 1. Unfortunately, as much as I love Diablo 1's music, it didn't fit the TL2 setting at all.
I thought he had been pretty clear in stating that getting a couple of level 10 items at character level 10 through drops is going to be extremely rare in Diablo 3. Also Blizzard can remove twinking as soon as they let me roll a level 30 character and skip Normal difficulty.
I spent the weekend replaying Diablo 3 while going through act 2 of Torchlight 2 and I think I may have to change my vote. They're both really neck and neck in my opinion, but I think Diablo 3 just slightly edges out Torchlight 2. I wrote up a small piece on my site with a deeper look at them. The TLDR version is that the problems that I have with Torchlight 2 (combat, defined classes) and Diablo 3 (loot varieties, more random maps), the problems with Diablo 3 are easier to fix compared to Torchlight 2. Blizzard can keep adding in more loot and sections to the game, but it would be a lot harder for Runic to redefined the classes and change the combat system around. I'm really hoping now that when Path of Exile comes out that the developers hit it out of the park. As from the beta, it felt like a good compromise between the two games. Huge degree of control with customizing your class and loot, while the combat system allowed you to try a variety of options.
You can turn monster power up to 10 and that's sort of like skipping Normal (in terms of presenting an actual challenge, at least.)
It's not really like skipping normal because you are still stuck with just a handful of skills which is indeed boring. However still less boring than Torchlight where for practical purposes you are stuck with a handful of skills the whole game.
I have yet to purchase either game, but am looking at doing so during the inevitable Christmas sales that will occur. Torchlight 2 is likely a no-brainer for me as I enjoyed the original and I saw it was selling for as little as $7.50 (as part of a 4-pack) over the Thanksgiving sales. As for Diablo III, I'm not as sure. While I see people really enjoy the new classes and skill system I also see a lot of people complain about the grind. If I just want to play through the single player story once to experience the whole thing, will I be "grinding" to gain levels or items to get past certain areas or does the first playthrough flow fairly evenly all the way through? I see people talking about needing to use the auction store to find equipment, trading all the useless stuff they find for things they actually need to advance once they're playing online or on the harder difficulties. Is this common? That sounds more like work and less like fun.
You do not need to grind through the story on normal, and if you do you will certainly find it way too easy. You also don't need to use the auction house in the earlier difficulties.
You shouldn't have to stop and grind in D3 on Normal - I don't think I hit any wall until a little on on Nightmare Diablo, and then no further wall til Inferno. (And that was before all the various changes to make things smoother/better.)
I've managed to put another ten levels on my witch doctor and she's now lvl 30. Around lvl 28 or so I had an inventory full of blues and yellows to vendor and I checked the average item level. It was 21. So, despite this being The Internet, I'm inclined to admit I was wrong earlier and AaronSofaer was r... r... an asshole right. I didn't think the lvl 8-10 blues I'd twinked myself were so good that I would have gone ten+ levels without seeing an upgrade, but infact they were pretty strong for a lowbie. Since I have upgraded out of them I've been seeing more use from my loot drops in general which has been fun. With MP being ticked up a couple notches the combat is fun while still moving along at a fast pace and the loot portion of the game is fun again. Post-patch D3 looks a lot like what I was expecting at launch and I think it'll keep recycling in my game queue when I feel like melting demons in acid clouds. I haven't voted on the TL2 vs D3 poll as I haven't tried TL2 but I can say that now D3 is a proper AAA title. I'll probably still pick up TL2 because, for the bargain price, I think I'll get my money's worth exploring a new set of scenery but from what I've read I'm not expecting the gameplay to stack up to D3.
1.5 months later... just finished the Starter Edition of Diablo 3 with a Barbarian. The new monster power setting makes a huge difference, I kept it on 10 the entire time and it's like starting out on Hard rather than the very easy & boring Normal. The final boss was an epic fight, if I were to continue I'd probably have to drop monster power a bit. I still don't intend to buy the full game, though. Really like the new character system with a gradually increasing choice of well-designed skills & runes that you can switch at any time, strongly dislike the oversized dungeons full of repetitive rooms and trash loot. As with Torchlight 2 I was mostly bored once I had learned the system and killed the first 100 monsters. I wonder if Grim Dawn will overcome my ARPG lethargy...
Twinking is basically putting a set on a character that they would not be able to acquire by normal gameplay (meaning by the time they got to where that drops/farmed all of that shit they'd have leveled past it) What people are debating is the degree of twinking allowed (putting level 60 gear on a level 10 without min-levels and such), but for example a WoW character at 20 with full blues is twinked compared to a level 20 who has recieved no items and is only using what has dropped. Anywho, I liked D3 more than TL2. I can't put my finger on why, but I hit max with two characters in D3, and can't bring myself to grind past act 2 in TL2. The skills all feel boring to me for some reason, and I have no desire to keep clicking. I have the same issue with PoE. The skill tree is neat. The actual skills you use however are boring as shit. D3 pretty much wins hands down for the skills and the rune modifications. I kind of wish they kept the beta dropped runes though.
