I tend to agree with this approach, especially because the Crest Shield is such a good all-rounder. In comparison the Magic WRS soaks a whole 4.5% magic damage more, at the expense of 15% worse physical damage reduction and garbage stability. I doubt I'll ever bother with it myself, although on the other hand I do always appreciate anybody who finds a use for seldom-used pieces of equipment.
I don't make builds with less than 16 strength and 30-40 END as a rule and just toy with these things for the novelty; if anything, I think I'm much more of an advocate for stability and poise than most people who have been playing the game for a while. I'm just passing on suggestions from people that do and seem to have great success with highly optimized builds; it then occurred to me that since I have no interest in making magic items through +10 that might be a potential tool that fills the gap. A lot of these items feel like leftovers from when twinkling titanite was supposed to be scarce and thus a magic shield that was regular upgrade path would have a certain value, and I think it's also clear that they did not gate the crest and dragon crest shields relative to their value in a manner that would ensure more gear variety (I mean, as compared to something like the Eagle shield or god forbid one of the ones you have to actually craft). I still remember 1.00 when the Hollow shield had ridiculous stability for cheap. 1.01 totally broke my balls.
People who don't summon people because they have unusual armor choices are making a mistake. Anyone trucking around in a Boar Helm and Catarina set or a Sack and Maiden set knows what they're doing, and someone decked out in full Giant's set might not.
I don't think there's a strong correlation between getting summoned and what you wear outside of a vocal DS fashionista contingent. I get summoned the same whether my character is dressed like an idiot, a well-balanced combination, or nearly naked. I get summoned wearing the quintessential troll child's mask, and it has no effect I can discern in PvP beyond the occasional saucy message because they think X is OP. But I also go through long droughts where only a restart gets me back in the game, and I can't tell when it starts or whether simply resetting the game will fix it. I was just messing with Charles because I thought he was slagging the Michelin Man. In conclusion, I wouldn't infer cultural causes for a problem where the network infrastructure problems are so omnipresent.
Also, the DS character builder has been updated for the latest patch, and in case it was unclear, the coop/PvP 10 levels +/- 10% applies to the user of the multiplayer item rather than the summoner. Calculations along the latter are what created the misconceptions about a broader range.
Man, you'd think that, but yesterday I did S&O four times. Three as a summon. No problems at all. So then I asked the guy I had just helped if he wanted to help me, since he seemed to know what he was doing, and he acquiesced. But when I summoned him, instead of having the gear we had fought with, he was wearing full Havel's, complete with the Dragon Bone. And he fucking ripped shit up! It was kind of amazing.
So I'm watching EpicNameBro's Dark Days series where he narrates an entire playthrough, and jesus christ it amazes me the things I still don't know about this game. Like how he manages to get past the second gate, near the boar, before it gets closed. I had never even considered doing that!
Right now I'm at 16 str, 15 dex, and 20 end on my sorceror. Again, I haven't ever messed with magic much in either game. Right now I can use the Drake sword, the winged spear, the claymore, and the Halberd (and I'm using Drake and Halberd primarily when using weapons). These are the only abilities I have improved. I'm unsure if I should beeline towards a much higher endurance or be adding more to strength. I'm a ways away from the Zweihander, e.g. OTOH, I'm going to be stuck at <50% for a long time with my current setup and throwing in the Zweihander won't really improve that. I'll need to secure some rings at some point obviously but the next 10-20 points of endurance are a big deal on their own. I realize some of this is more about playstyle, but I'm thinking of going down the endurance road for now, even though I'll probably only have mediocre armor to use for some time.
Why are you focusing on str if you're making a Sorcerer? I can understand it to meet particular weapon requirements but I think you might be considering weapons that may not be the best for a magic build. The Moonlight Greatsword should probably be your Str/Dex target and you've already reached it. What weapon do you intend on using long term here?
If you're really going to be a sorcerer, you should be adding attunement and INT. You'll want INT to 44 at a minimum (for crystal soul spear). Forget the Zwei, your weapons goals as a sorcerer are the moonlight butterfly horn first (pre-sens), and then later (post lordvessel) on the moonlight greatsword. If you're going more as a spell-sword combo and just utility spells, well, I suppose STR and END are always good. IMO, I just saved those to the end (i.e. NG+) for my sorcerer.
The key to good stat management in this game is to really try and not pick more than three stats to dump points in. Anything else you raise to the minimum necessary for your gear and that's that. So basically, you pick a main stat (which is going to be one of str/dex/int/faith), and then you raise that one primarily ahead of the others, and then only put stats into your main three. So for a caster, that's int/end/vit, with attunement raised to the amount of slots you want as they become necessary. Int is your primary so it should always be highest. If you want to raise more than three to something high (high generally meaning more than 16 or so), then you are going to have a tough time of it and won't see the fruits of your labor until well into NG+.
I agree, but I feel the attunment cost is so much cheaper (i.e. easier) at low levels that I'd like to get them filled out ASAP. Getting up in SL and thinking, "gee, I'd like 2 or 3 more slots" and then realize you'de need to burn 100,000+ souls (at least) to get those levels can be frustrating.
Ehh. Levels are levels. You get them when you need them. Having 5 or 6 attunement slots before you have 5 or 6 spells is an absurd waste of souls, especially when you will be exchanging power now for (potential) versatility later.
The order doesn't matter so much I don't think, as long as the trend is to get int way up high before anything else. Ideally you would push int to 36 before starting Sen's Fortress, rescue Big Hat, return to Firelink Shrine, and then purchase and immediately start using Soul Spear, but realistically a lot of people aren't going to make that trip backwards anyway so I don't think there's anything wrong with targeting 36 int at roughly the same time as you get the Lordvessel.
I don't think you can push ATN that fast, but there are a fair number of spells to get from Griggs early on, and even more if you rescue the Dusk. Of course I should add that you prioritize INT, but if you find yourself post boss and enough souls to get a slot and INT? I'd get the slot, too. I never found myself with more slots than spells.
I think the bigger issue with attunement re: sorcery specifically is that sorcery is balanced to some extent by giving you fewer and fewer casts as spells get progressively better. That's the only reason you even need to add attunement slots, really; as a sorcerer you start with three attunement slots, or 60 Soul Arrows. 60 casts of a worthwhile projectile spell would be more than enough for the whole game. But as you start getting 12, then 8, then 4 casts of each spell, you have to add more slots to compensate. So it's not really a question of ever having more slots than spells (which never happens, really), as it is a question of whether or not you have slots that you're attuning subpar spells in, which usually does mean that you've leveled attunement to quickly. Now: that thinking only really applies to offensive spells. If you actually do make use of the likes of Cast Light and Hidden Body, by all means add more attunement so you can bring them along without sacrificing your good offensive spells. I suspect from context clues that that isn't Charles's style, though.
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the order not mattering. As far as soul cost goes for leveling, no it doesn't matter, going from level X to X+1 costs the same regardless of your stat distribution. However allocating stats is an on going process and you don't immediately get to level X. So lets consider what Cheesy said: While your goal might be to have say 6 spell slots that doesn't mean it's prudent to dump your first several points into attunement to reach that goal. You should put points into getting more slots as you obtain spells to put in them. Otherwise you've spent a bunch of points to have a bunch of empty spell slots that don't give you any benefit for quite some time. You're better served puting those first points into a stat you'll actually use at the moment or very near future, be it vit, end or to meet equipment requirements. Any perceived cost is just that, perception. Once you reach the point where you've got 36 int, 6 attunement slots and 40 vit and end how you got there doesn't matter, you've spent the same number of souls, you should get there in the manner that best benefits you on the way.
I more meant in the first part of the game within reasonable bounds. The sense I got was that he was talking about preferring to pick up a few extra attunement slots early on to pushing int as hard and fast as possible, and I think that's fine. You're going to want 36 int and 4-5 slots by the time you get the lordvessel, that's the main thing. Also, I'm sympathetic to wanting to "get it out of the way," since it does kind of suck later on to buy levels and not get the benefit until you buy even more levels, but then again intelligence kind of works that way too since you don't get anything new between 36 and 50.
INT at least rewards you with damage scaling spells and weapons, though. Also, CSS is 44 INT. Later on adding ATN you get your added resistances, but whoever notices one or two (or three or four) levels worth of those?
I should probably ask my question a little differently. It's really more "should I worry about defense seriously before offense". Though you've answered it.
To be super-clear, the problem with the way you asked the question isn't just that you should have asked whether you should focus on offense or defense, it's that you misidentified your offensive stat - it is intelligence, not strength. You should not raise your strength again at any point for the entire rest of the game.
I was talking about raising my strength in the context of which weapon to use. I don't have to play this character as a straight sorcerer. I wasn't talking about raising strength past a specific point. I can't recall if upgrading items alters the stat requirements or not, but I'm thinking not.
Although more endurance is always helpful (up to 40, of course) in that it gives you more stamina to run & block with and also opens up more armor for you to wear, 20 end will be enough to wear some decent armor while using the zwei and remaining at <25 encumbrance when you get Havel's ring. I should know; I've just spent the last couple days playing my first all-strength build. In my haste to make all those nifty strength weapons useable ASAP, as well making some basic utility spells available (I'm planning on eventually getting 18 int & 18 faith for a couple of those special swords), I ended up going all the way through Ando Londo with just 12 vit and 16 end. It got pretty.... challenging... there after a while. You ever try swinging a large club or dragon's tooth with just 16 end? It ain't pretty. I got winded just lifting the thing up to my shoulder. Anyway, my point is that when I was using the relatively light zweihander & Havel's ring, I was able to wear some pretty decent light armor at <25 encumbrance, and some rather good heavy armor at <50. Granted, now that I'm *finally* raising my endurance, I don't have to micromanage whether I can afford to keep a bow in my offhand anymore. (Shit's heavy, man! Sucker weighs a whole pound!) And I'm beginning to be able to splurge and wear almost a whole suit of heavy armor, rather than just the legs & hands. But yeah... with Havel's, you should be able to get by with 20 end. I'd just like to add that I'm *not* saying that raising end would be a bad idea. End & vit are always good. I'm just saying that if you're feeling slightly masochistic, and willing to be oh-so-careful with what you put on your weapon slots, you can get by with 20.
Upgrading them never ever alters the stat requirements, but it can improve the stat scaling. For that reason, if you're using a short bow or a long bow, you should always reinforce them 1 step ASAP. Besides getting the standard amount of raw damage upgrade from the reinforcement, their dex scaling improves from A to S after a reinforcement. Even if you're leaving your dex at default levels, the change in scaling makes a huge damage difference.
The point we're trying to make is that if you are going for an int based caster, you want to build your character around the moonlight greatsword. Putting strength above the requirements for that weapon is a huge waste for your character, because even if you don't use the moonlight greatsword you will still want to roll with a magic/enchanged weapon, and for those the damage will scale with int.
Yeah, all of the good options (Moonlight Greatsword, Moonlight Butterfly Horn, Velka's Rapier) fit inside 16 str/16 dex. peacedog you're not screwed up yet, just don't take either of those higher than that unless you want to give up on playing the sorcery build. You're right that you don't have to be a straight sorcerer, but if you want to play any kind of sorcerer at all there's just not much percentage in the Zweihander... you could make an enchanted one but it would probably still end up doing less damage than the Moonlight Greatsword despite being a hell of a lot slower.
Also if you don't crank your int way up, you'll find that sorcery doesn't do much for you as your limited pools of spells don't do enough damage per hit for it to be worthwhile over going straight weapon physical.
Depends on what you mean by "way up." I think ranged sorcery really starts paying off at 36 int, when you have 8 Soul Spear + 10 homing Crystal Soulmass for a decent number of casts of very high damage spells, but 32 is where you can really start to get the most out of Crystal Magic Weapon if you're so inclined. Below that though, yes, you're a lot more limited since the only ranged spell you have that I would consider high level is HCMS, which isn't even maxed out until 32. The Soul Arrow family starts showing its age around Anor Londo and by the time you get to the post-Lordvessel areas you'll find yourself using them primarily to pull enemies into your sword if those are still the spells you're using.
AU CONTRAIRE! I ramped my dude up to 50 int or so pretty quick, and once I started using the Tin Crystalization Catalyst I was one-shotting most enemies with Great Soul Arrow. But even before I was that high there were plenty of places where Great Soul Arrow could do significant damage. But regardless, if you are going to push str/dex much higher than 16 it'll be much later in the game before you end up with your int in the mid 30s.
Yeah, same here. I still use various soul arrows and I'm halfway through NG+ on my sorceror. I don't one-shot things, but that's fine... two shotting is good enough for me, and I like having the large number of weaker casts, since I have a bad habit of misjudging the range & missing.
Well it sounds like I should put my next point in Dex then, and then I'm more than ok on End for awhile.
Nah, just kidding. I'm tolerant of all viewpoints, even crass refusal to acknowledge the supremacy of Logan's Catalyst. It did get me wondering though if using the TCC + GHSA might ever be better than Logans + CSS, since you get four casts either way. So I ran a quick test just now by blasting the shit out of some hollows in NLR (50 int, Crown of Dusk, Bellowing Dragoncrest Ring, NG+++): TCC GHSA: 912 CSS: 1369 Logan's GHSA: 721 CSS: 1102 So: no. But more to the point holy shit sorcery does so much damage. I hope you're looking at those numbers, everybody. When I tell you that sorcery is the best I am not fucking around.
Who two-shots things? YOU ARE WASTING YOUR POTENTIAL. If an enemy even starts moving in my direction before they're dead I consider the fight a failure.
but my face is so ugly when I'm hollow! Seriously there is so much shit that is undocumented in the sparse manual and incomplete tutorial. I have no idea what I'm doing (other than grinding the same 6 undead near the bonfire so I can level up my STR until I can equip this 2-handed sword I found in the graveyard)
