Dealing with depression

I believe the point that is being made is that posting about your feelings and putting them in context is welcome. Throwing up a few lines about how sad you are with nothing more just comes across as self-indulgent instead of self-helping.

Sometimes thats what a person who is depressed needs to do, just vent where people are listening. If it helps that person why should we tell them it isnt welcome here?

Because at least to an extent, the purpose of a message board is to foster discussion. There are other outlets that are better designed for a single person sharing their thoughts to listeners, which is what that would become. It seems only fair to meet the other posters halfway and give the proper context/background of what you're feeling so that others can engage with you.

Everything we do on this board has 'other outlets', maybe this is where the person feels most comfortable doing it for whatever reason. If we want this thread here to help people, I dont see what the issue is I guess. But if its deemed such things arent welcome here I guess that is how it will be.

MY FEELS. HURTS AND EMOS.

Then make a thread of depression venting or something, I don't even feel like I can post in this damn thread anymore.

Why not? Does a person dealing with their depression in a way you don't approve of bother you that much?

I don't see why there has to be a separate thread from this one, seems stupid to me.

This is definitely not constructive discussion as pertains to the original spirit of this thread and I would argue that you are beginning to wander dangerously close to trolling.

This, yes. I've noted that if I'm having a two-Vicodin day, one of the side effects is often hypnagogic hallucinations, usually with tactile elements. NOT FUN.

Forgive me for wanting to allow people who are depressed to deal with it in whatever way they want to. Please go back to judging them for not doing it in your approved way. I will just take the hint that I am not welcome to share in this thread anymore.

I'll just put my two cents in - there are plenty of places where one can simply vent on the internet. In fact, it's a huge portion of the internet, blogs, facebook, forums, e-mail, your secret public journal. However, there are very few places where people who have been what you might be going through can offer constructive advice, opinions, and feedback. Unfortunately, venting clouds those things, it's merely the vomiting up of those emotions.

This isn't a perfect analogy (in fact it's a shitty one), but if we had a thread called "Dealing with Addiction" centered around peoples experiences getting help for addiction - it would not be helpful to have people talk about how hard they fell off the wagon - how badly they wanted a drink etc. That's what AA is for - that's what therapy is for - that's the work. This thread does not do the work thus treating as a place to do the work only makes it harder for real dialogue to happen.

Unfortunately, this thread is not a support group. But if you wanted advice in finding a support group, this would be the perfect thread to ask for it. See the difference?

EDIT: my previous edit was pointless.

Let's try doing this the "right" way. Or what I've grasped to be the right way.

Shit's been shitty. Had an appointment with the therapist that I had to drop because life happened. Wish it didn't take forever to see the therapist.
and now the part where you show that you're doing something to deal with your shitty issues that aren't self-harmful? am i getting this? idfk if i'm getting this.
Keeping myself busy and leaving myself no time to think seems to work relatively well.
Going to keep doing that.

did i do this right
no, seriously, did i do this right because i don't know how to do this right. obviously.

Putting things aside til you can deal with it is perfectly valid, the problem arises when life is a crisis after another and no time to deal ever arrives. You will find yourself years later wondering where the time went, and why you are upset. Mostly because by that point you have gotten so far past what you needed to deal with you have no recollection of the actual event only the emotional marker.

I don't have a better solution but you should keep the above in mind as time passes. Sometimes it has worked for me, in that the edge of the issue is gone and since I cannot grasp the entire issue I am able to handle it more detached.
Other times it has me .. in one particular case.. crawling under a table in public and bawling. I certainly hope this does not happen to anyone else.

(1) I am lucky, and don't suffer from depression, just run of the mill blues now and again and
(2) am atheist but...
(3) I found going transcendental a few times in meditation really helped. That blissful feeling that we are all connected by love, and there is a white heat of pure love for everything in this whole universe - yes it is spiritual/ mystical but I smile just recalling it.

Of course, being my parents' son, I rationalise it by thinking said mystical ecstacy is almost certainly a evolutionary counterpart of consciousness. Imagine those of our ancestors who didn't have dreams or illusions or hope or love, their survival rate would be lower than those who never gave up hope - the 'Life of Pi' effect.

If you feel bad then that is important, always, because you are hurting and you shouldn't be. Your feelings are important. I'm not saying you should keep it inside, when we are hurt we look to others to get validation, acceptance, and to hear that, yes, this broken leg hurts like a bitch, and it's no difference when the hurt is all in your head.

My issue with venting and depression is that I think it's ultimately a trap. Someone feels bad, then they vent a bit, feel better, then a few weeks pass and they feel bad again and the process repeats itself because the depression hasn't healed. It's not improving, you're just in a holding pattern, but you have your outlet that lets you temporarily push the hurt away and that's enough to keep you going.

I'm not in this thread to judge anyone, living with depression is hard and above all you have to learn how to cope, venting might be that thing that keeps you up. But, neither do I want people to think that venting will make them better in the long run. Whatever issues you have, they won't go away simply by talking about them. Talking about them is important, but it's just a first step and there are many more steps to go.

Regular venting, when I did it, was just a way for me to keep from making hard choices in my life while fantasizing about being saved from my miserable life by someone or something. I wasted years on it. Not speaking up when I think I see people walking down that same path would be wrong because I wouldn't wish my unhappiness or my wasted years on anyone.

I think you're misrepresenting some of discussion here - I don't think anyone has been criticized for feeling a certain way. There are differences of opinion as to the effective and appropriate uses of a forum thread, but to my knowledge, nobody has been told "you cannot / should not feel that way."

I too have been very hesitant about posting here, but for completely different reasons. People have very strong ideas about the "correct" way to talk about depression, and if you run afoul of what they perceive to be the "correct" way, you'll get dogpiled. Especially if you're perceived (justifiably or not) as being anything less than 110% sensitive to the idiosyncratic needs of a person or group of people who suffer from depression, even if you suffer from it yourself. It's an interesting conundrum.

I'll say one thing that will likely make me very unpopular, which I've been thinking for a while but been afraid to say out loud: I don't think Brokenforum.com is a website that needs to cater to every need of every one of its members. It's great that we have threads to discuss issues that many of us share, but I don't think it's Lum's responsibility to provide a web-based support group for those of us who suffer from depression. I think this thread and the other venting thread are very useful for a lot of people, but as others have said, they're no substitute for a dedicated depression support group and certainly not a replacement for therapy from a trained medical professional.

This should be reiterated a lot. Lots and lots and lots.

Anyway, I would love to hear what you've hesitant to post. I think this thread has shown that we're comfortable not being perceived as 110% sensitive to what you said etc etc, as evidenced by the forced birth of that other thread. I would like to think that pretty much any approach aside from "why don't you try just being happy?" would be met pretty openly and with discussion rather than dogpiles. If you squint really hard and from a great distance, even that could probably be justified in terms of CBT or whatever, and I think that even happened already in the thread.

On the other hand, this is the internet, so I'm probably being naive.

Being the weird sort I am.. Much of this thread if read in a slightly different tone of voice can go from supportive to deriding fast. Same can be said of the more emotional post going from that slightly sighing tone of resigned acceptance of another damned day feeling bad, to the whining why can't I just die already sobbing mess.

It is all in how one reads the words and in what voice/tone they are inferred.

I am not insulting ANYONE. I do presume to make the case of this miscommunication since it has plagued all my online communities most my internet life. Some of us are working through things one way.. others a different way. Some things cannot be delt with in every moment by a therapist and for many of us this has become a defacto community. We/they/I/ you .. feel close enough to others here due to similar likes and dislikes to try and establish deeper bonds or at least deeper conversations.

What we do forget is we are .. this is the wider we.. very very eclectic here. For all our similarities there are many upon many ways we can subdivide and still not find a core group that we get along with well.

Should we sweep this conversation entirely under the rug and attempt to pretend like no one feels this way? No..
Should we rant at each other because a post might be more emotional than another might want to read.. again I say no.
I do think we have to remember that we are dealing with humans, kinda broken ones at that but I think there is no default unbroken state. Let's try to reach beyond both our tears and our words, maybe just give that moment of support. Like's kinda work that way sometimes.
We also need to be aware not to spend day in and day out mentioning the horror or sadness that might come along in our lives. Yet .. and I am as guilty of this as anyone.. grief/depression/emotions are what they are. We cannot force someone happy, nor can we force someone sad.

We in the end are all figments of each other's imagination, human broken twisted and wonderful imaginations.

Just to clarify some more.
I think the type of post you mentioned, is the type people don't like seeing in this thread. The posts talking about difficult or negative things, I don't think any body has a problem with because it is part of dealing with depression. It's the bolded stuff above that isn't helpful.

I agree. I can't speak for anyone else here, but those kinds of posts can be very triggering, and it's unpleasant coming into a discussion about problems such as these and leaving feeling worse than when you started. Does this make sense? I'm having a hard time with coherency at the moment.

Anyway, going off-topic for a minute. I feel guilty for barging into the middle of a serious discussion, but I was wondering if I could ask for some advice (if this isn't an okay kind of thing to post here, I'll gladly delete it).

So I've got pretty severe anxiety, which I usually keep under control with a combination of Cymbalta/Valium/coping strategies. However, for the last couple of days, my baseline anxiety level has been through the roof, so to speak, and nothing I do is bringing it down. I've tried Valium, sleep, my weighted blanket, cuddling my cat, talking to and cuddling with my girlfriend, talking with my grandmother (who has issues similar to mine), drinking decaf tea, bubble baths, meditation, and listening to music, some alone and some in combination.
I was wondering if anyone here who deals with anxiety had any ideas for me to try (I talked with my therapist today, but everything she suggested, I'd already done).

If you feel up to it, I sometimes find that going for a walk with a music player can be helpful to calm down a bit. It's not something I force myself to do, as if I'm feeling sad already then it can give me too much freedom to dwell on things, but it's given me some relief in the past few weeks. Your anxiety sounds a lot more severe than mine, though, so apologies if this isn't helpful at all.

(i think this is fine to go here because i'm looking for thoughts or advice, but i'm okay moving it if not)
Today I had one of my last review sessions for my apprenticeship, and the college staff guy came over and explained to my boss what he needed to write for his 3rd party witness statements.

My boss is aware of my depression and how easily I get stressed, I think. In the next week I have to complete three essays, only two of which I've started (this is because I'm pretty awful for procrastination). I need to annotate my evidence for all five units and take photographs of anything I'm missing. There are also a couple other forms to fill out, which I've barely looked at because it's all corporate buzzword nonsense.

So, anyway, the review went okay, but afterwards my boss said to me, "You know, I don't have time for this; I wouldn't even know where to begin."
He suddenly got a brilliant idea and continued, "Hey, maybe you should just write the witness statements and I'll change a couple of things."
Okay, I need two witness statements. Do you see that there's a possibility I might struggle with things if I added the statements to my workload?

Hghghhh, I'm really not good at talking to authority figures (bad enough that I couldn't ask to borrow 13p so I had enough for lunch the other day), so I'm not really sure what to do here!

I was going to suggest physical activity also, vayaviya. A lot of anxiety (at least for me) is nervous energy, and if I tire myself out, I'm often too tired to get anxious.

It's sad at how far I've fallen when I'm proud of myself for driving 45 minutes straight -- 15 of which was on the freeway -- without falling asleep behind the wheel. At least this means I'm getting better, right? Right.

Any progress is still progress! FEEL YOUR PRIDE SHAMELESSLY!

Does anyone here have experience with Venlafaxine? I'm probably going to switch to it quite soon, which is a scary prospect both because I've only had fluoxetine before, and because I'm nervous about the transition period.

Edit: just reading up on it a bit, and wondering if I'll need to be very aware of myself about this, because it seems to have a higher increase in suicidal thoughts than fluoxetine for young people. Oh, anti-depressants. Always so contradictory.

The big thing with Effexor is don't stop taking it suddenly. Discontinuation symptoms are MUCH worse for Effexor than for other SSRIs. Even missing one dose can fuck with some people. So try to take it at the same time every day.

Overall it's a pretty good drug, though. good luck!

I might be able to shed some light, since I was on venlafaxine for ~5 years. I felt nauseous for the first few days of taking it and had a lowered appetite, but that went away quickly. Remember that side affects are different for everyone, so try not to worry too much about the 'potential' ones. Just keep them in mind when you start taking the new meds, and definitely let your doc know if anything is troubling you. The main thing (in my experience) is finding the right dosage, but your doctor will help with that. And if you have a terrible memory like me, set an alarm or something to help you remember to take it each day. Whenever I'd forget, I'd start to feel like a zombie later in the day. :\

Turns out that there's a connection between my depression and my taking birth control. That week when I'm on the sugar pills is like emotional hell, made worse because that time of the month is coming. Also remember being almost constantly in a state of depression back when I didn't have the money to take birth control.

Is it possible for birth control to be used as an antidepressant? What hormone is being simulated/messed with that is also involved with depression? I feel like it's related to...something levels.

This probably isn't very useful as I don't know details about the medical context, but you certainly aren't the first woman to notice a correlation between birth control and depression (or lack thereof). Anecdotally, an old girlfriend had problems with her birth control worsening her depression (not alleviating it) and I have a friend who had a similar issue to what you're seeing - that her BCPs actually stabilize her emotionally. Hormones are crazy powerful stuff.

Yes. This.

Some allow you to just switch from one to the other as they push the same Crazy buttons, but Effexor definitely needs to be weened off of per doctor's orders. I came off one too fast once, not sure if it was Effexor, and I felt like I was being almost physically crushed for several days. Ugh, it was bad.

I have been on too many of these, methinks. None of the drugs mentioned ever sound unfamiliar. :)

Hormones can fuck with your head like nothing else. I am more sensitive to them than most female-bodied people. Last December I very nearly committed suicide because of a switch in birth control pills. I had my first psychotic break at age 16 due to birth control pills. I've tried many brands, and they all fuck with me in some way or another. This goes for Depo-Provera and NuvaRing, too -- anything that changes my hormonal balance. Since last year's near-death experience, I've stopped taking birth control pills completely. I'd rather use condoms than risk my life. I'm not willing to go on testosterone for the same reason -- fear of more mental instability.

So if they can cause depression, there's no reason they can't do the opposite in someone with different body chemistry than me. You probably should talk to your doctor about the changes in mood. Gynecologists are pretty familiar with this stuff.

I started on birth control precisely because I noticed a significant difference in mood around that time of the month. Specifically, every month, I noticed I was consistently getting suicidal, terrified of everything, flying into blind rages, and during my last month pre-birth control, I had a brief psychotic break (I was okay during the rest of the month, for the record). I went to the doctor, they diagnosed me with PMDD, put me on Yazmin, and then everything got SO much better. I still experience some pretty severe anxiety and pain when I'm on the white pills, but it's much better than it was.

In short, hormones can fuck you up. If you can talk to your doctor about what you've noticed, I'd highly recommend it.

Hi all. I recently (just over a month ago) switched to Lexapro from Effexor and I've gained about 5kg. Has anyone else been on Lexapro and experienced weight gain? My weight was fairly steady on the Effexor, after all... Although I suppose my gaining weight may have something to do with the vast abundance of food that typically surrounds the holiday season.

Don't. I've been doing that for a long time thinking I was fine. I felt that depression and anxiety were things that happened to other people who couldn't move on, not me. Then a comment was made recently, just a little thing, but it got me thinking and it basically opened the door to almost 40 years of pain, hurt and anger that I thought I had a handle on. I would bury it, forget it and move on. But it's now coming out, and it's all coming out at once, and for the first time in my life I have to see someone about it because if I don't, I honestly don't know if I will be able to move forward.

I may post about it later, but in the meantime, my advice is to deal with things as they happen lest they overwhelm you later.

Depressed people often don't approach their condition in a constructive way. Hell, that's practically one of the major symptoms of depression. Just because a depressed person wants to deal in a certain way doesn't mean it's a helpful way to deal with it. I'm not sure if the way that Ned is guiding the discussion is necessarily the best way to deal with depression, but it seems like a reasonable stab at it.

The thing about venting is that it's rarely helpful in & of itself. (From what I understand, at any rate. I'm not a trained psychologist, so I could be wrong.) What's helpful about the venting is the connection that you build with another person. So your day sucked, you contemplated suicide, etc. I question if posting those feelings/thoughts on a messageboard is helpful to anyone. If you were physically talking to someone, sharing those feelings can be helpful because of the shared eye contact & connection that is formed. Hell, when you share those feelings in person, the other person can look into *your* eyes and see if you're trying to form a connection or if you're just wallowing in self-pity. It you're doing the latter, hopefully the other person would try to steer you into doing the former.

Someone that I respect a lot characterized depression as "The turning away from life". It's a simple summation of the condition, but it rings true to me over & over whenever I sink into depression. And, to be honest, sometimes that's what I want to do. I'm content to turn away from life for a week or two. But beyond a week or two, it becomes problematic. And keeping that summation in mind helps me to find... I don't want to say "my way out of depression", but... I don't know how to phrase it. To find the perspective to sort of leave the condition behind, maybe? I'm not sure... those words are inadequate. And they describe the process much too cleanly. But I've found that things that I would describe as "engaging with life" to be good counters to depression. When you're in the depth of the condition, you don't have the energy to engage too much, but as you engage more & more, the condition does tend to recede. Of course, you eventually need to deal with whatever caused the depression in the first place, but having a way out of the depths of the condition is helpful. For me, at any rate.

In any case, that's why the distinction between "wallowing in self-pity" and "building a connection" is so important in my mind. The latter is engaging with life. The former is, at best, neutral with regards to engagement.

It's not about judging anyone. Even when Creole Ned comes in to put the kibosh on directionless venting, I don't get the feeling that he's judging. Rather, I get the feeling that he's trying to keep the discussion moving in a constructive direction. I get the feeling that his motive isn't so much "what's best for the depressive person", but rather "this is what message boards excel at." As he's said before, no one can do anything with directionless venting. But if you want to discuss techniques for dealing, or even insights to the condition, messageboards are great at that. And of course, Ned can correct me if I've mischaracterized him in any way.

Edit - Damnit, I responded to a post that was 3 weeks old. Sorry.