Ever17 headscratching thread - Heavy spoilers within!

Okay, that scene with Kid looking at the mirror and realizing that he's not Kid- is that in one of the Kid's routes, or is that a Coco route thing?

Also, I don't think the lifescan fluctuations were ever fully explained. That was probably the moment where I started getting invested in the story and the mystery of Ever17, so it's a bummer that it wasn't ever answered in the text.

Sora's a hologram, of course, so the sixth life form isn't her. Could it be the pet? It's been a while, but I think Tsugumi had a pet rat or something like that... or was it a dog... crap, it's been too long since I read this VN.

Coco's dog is a robot, Sora is a hologram... Tsugumi didn't have a rat. It was a HUNGARIAN HAMSTER. I love that I remember those details but can't recall most of Sara's route aside from important events and the ending.

Also, Blick Winkel is traveling around, so there is that.

Annnnd Kid's freak out is in Coco's route, I think. Maybe there is a mirror scene in Sara's too, but it's not until Coco's that he snaps. I think.

Blick Winkel fluctuating between routes makes sense, I guess, but why does the hamster make the number flicker too? Maybe it accidentally got caught in a ceiling fan or something and died but then respawned. Hence the flickering.

(Please tell me I'm remembering it correctly that the hamster can resurrect itself, like Tsugumi.)

It can. In fact, Tsugumi "kills it" to prove a point to Takeshi later on.

Still, I have no idea if at that point the hamster had bitten her yet. This is so confusing. ; _;

The living people in LeMU are You'haru/You'aki, Coco/Sara, Takeshi/Kaburaki, Kaburaki jr/Hokuto and Tsugumi, so that's five. Then we count Blick Winkel and have one flickering number more.

In 2017 there is a scientist in a place that may or may not be reached by the sensors. In 2034, there are actually two people there. I don't think the guys down there count, because if it they did, the number should've risen to 8 on Kid's routes. They were all in the advanced stages of Tief Blau, though, so it would kinda make sense for their numbers to flicker since they are either dying or frozen?

Then we remember *~*Magical*~* Coco and her dimension/time travels.

And then there is the hamster which should be present in both routes.

We have no idea of how Coco's deal works, and we have no idea if LeMU's detectors actually work on non-humans, even if it is hinted that it does.

So

Uh

Let's just say that Blick Winkel counts for two?

Why so little love for Sora? :(

I also played the routes in this order that was recommended to me: Tsugumi, Sora, You, Sara, but I don't know, I can't understand what everyone finds in Tsugumi. Even after I knew her past and her suffering, I couldn't deal with her tsundere's side.
Sora's route instead made me cry A LOT. Maybe I played it in a day that was particularly emotional for me, but the fact is I kept crying for the whole course of her route :/ The scene when they are at both sides of the mirror and Takeshi tries to "put" lipstick on Sora mouth ç______ç
I know her route means that Takeshi goes basically insane and falls in love with an hologram, but I don't know, maybe I'm a sucker for impossible loves?

That said, I'm curious about one thing. Did you guys get the "different timeline" thing while playing the first routes or like me you were totally oblivious until the game points that out? Because I had a friend that was playing it and when I said "Just wait for the biggest wtf of the game!" he answered me "The different timeline thing? I already got that."... I felt like an idiot at the time °_°

Most people like tsundere characters. Plus, Tsugumi has really good voice acting. Sora's route is a bit freaky, although interesting, I think most people get rather unconformable because it's filled with people being unhinged and yandere and rape. Tsugumi's route does tugs at your heartstrings, especially at the end, where they keep joking around to not flip out because the situation is so very, very bad.

Re: different timelines things: I think I did notice something off (there are some things that don't turn out the same in both routes, such as Sara/Coco), but I dismissed it, since, well, how would that work? I also totally did not expect the Holy Shit Quotient, and was too caught up in all the other, seriously freaky things going on (the flickering life meter scared the shit outta me). I think most people didn't catch on, since it's part of the big reveal. You do notice alot of hints after you've seen the true ending, naturally (hindsight is always 20/20).

Tsugumi was my favourite route! I always cry during her end when when takashi sea floor drown love cry desu tsundere ;A;

I always wondered how she...You know, ate? She was below extreme poverty but someone she could still survive. Any theories on that?

Sara's route got me pretty confused. It's like "oh time to romance this g- HOLY CRAP ITS MY SISTER ok sexual tension FLY OFF AND WELCOME BACK FAMILY LOVE." Like, I get it. She's kids sister, but still. They definitely had something goin on there and it just magically poofs out.

Well, if you think really really hard about it and take in account the message at the end of the normal routes, then you can very possibly discover that early. It doesn't take away the OMGWTFBBQ of the how and why, though.

The thing with Sora isn't as much with the character as with the route itself. It feels as if the narrative dropped a bit in comparison, you know? I rather like Sora and I was bawling like a baby at the latter parts of her route, because it was so damn foreseeable (is that even a word?) that it was going to have a depressing ending.

I do have a thing for tsunderes, there is no denying that, and Tsugumi's combination of kuu/dan/tsunderism pushed all my yes buttons, but I actually liked her character beyond that. Even before learning about her past.

I think certain things of her character hit me close to home, not in a bad way. I mean... how can I explain it? I think I actually related to her in many ways, certainly not in the same scale or with the same approach, but I did, so watching her view on life evolve as her shell cracked was specially rewarding and touching for me.

Also, her story post-Takeshi's "death" resembles my mother's story to an uncanny extent, hahaha. Ha.

I remember that I was scared shitless for the "who kicked the can if we're all here" thing, but the life meter thing was scary too. And yeah there are hints of the different timelines, but you get it only after the true ending. It's funny now to think of the part when they restart the engine, with Takeshi they make the countdown from 17 and with Kid from 34...
But the funniest thing is that everything is actually revelaled in the opening, if you look at it after completing the game... hell you see appearing all the important words, including Blick Winkel!

You should see the XBox 360 edition opening. Now that is just plain... dunno if spoilerific, because you don't really understand unless you've played it, but they show some weird stuff. Like mini-Kaburaki and Kaburaki sitting next to each other.

The fact that Tsugumi's outfit is completely different in kid's route from Takeshi's route is practically yelling the biggest spoiler of the game.

Pretty much, yes.

Still, I've heard that the "bad" changes are pretty much equal to the "good" changes. I mean, they seem to have expanded a lot on some stuff while at the same time cutting some of the goddamn padding which will eventually drive me nuts, I tell you.

Out of sheer curiosity I would have liked to play the remake. I'm also hoping somewhat that they eventually remake R11 with a proper ending, but that is completely off-topic. Any clues as to what other changes they made in the 360 version?

Another route post-Coco explaining more stuff, changes on minor events (the main stuff is still the same), and it also seems like they expanded on the characters' past. At least on Hokuto and Sara's, who are now totally badass.

You know, they never really paid that much attention to Sara's screwtastic traumatic past, so I think that is a pretty good change.

Also, they re-recorded everything and tweaked the music. Some of the originally hair-rising creepy songs are now pretty badass(ly horrifying), I've heard.

Now I really want to check out that remake...maybe Aksys will bring it over one of these days? A girl can dream.

No idea, gurl. I only know that if it's for the 360 my chances to emulate it are close to none, and that there doesn't seem to be any plans for a translation.

I feel like the best chance to check it out we'd have, would be to see someone let's playing it. And that isn't too probable either.

I'm sorry for double posting and all, but...

While LPing, as you most probably saw, I got into the blackout scene. And I tell you, I didn't remember it being so irritatingly stupid. What I mean specifically is that Sora's status as a hologram is known by everyone else (except Coco, I think), but they still all agree on "let's split up and look for Sora". Tsugumi stays silent and later half-lampshades it, but You and Kid seem perfectly content with running around LeMU looking for someone that won't be there.

Maybe they just couldn't be bothered to enlighten our dear protag, but it still bugged me a lot.

I think part of it is that she doesn't really 'fit' well into the overall scheme of things once you know the full story.

There is, after all, only one True timeline. The Kid's romantic issues resolve themselves easily enough, since Sara is his sister and not really an option, so you can weave together developments from both Sara's and You's paths to create a consistent balance of him liking them both. But Takeshi has to be with Tsugumi for the whole plot to happen. Sora is just an offshoot that doesn't fit into the cool interconnectedness of the rest of the story.

... also, as someone who's had both long-distance and internet-only-never-meeting relationships for real, the angst factor of "But she's a hologram and I can't touch her" didn't work that well for me, because given the tech-level of the setting, "robot body" seemed like such an obvious solution, and I'm used to having to wait a lot longer than a few days to get back together with long-distance people.