Games Journalism Fart Attack: 2013 Edition

Discussion in 'PC/Console Game Discussion' started by Reldan, Jan 29, 2013.

  1. Charles Despondent Fancybear

    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    I always just assumed that if a review is littered with bullshots, they were paid for the review. Hell, I'd believe the publisher wrote it for them at that point. if you can't even take your own screenshots to back up your review, how am I supposed to believe you even did one?
  2. Zekedms Elitist Negative Nancy

    There's a difference between a small timer working with consoles and a big timer working with consoles, of course. I appreciate that, having had to rely on developer provided shots before.

    But if there's a PC option and you're not taking your own screenshots, you have absolutely no excuse. Hell, all you have to do these days is run FRAPS or hammer the Steam screenshot key.

    No sane person would give this a 9/10. Ever.
  3. UnSub Armchair Designer

    Polygon mentioned in their review that they usually use publisher provided shots:

    They didn't for A:CM on the grounds that the differences were too great, but there's a bias that's very possible to occur when you are using the best possible shots to show off a title with.
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  4. Reldan Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    I've also encountered rare circumstances where a dealer at a casino table game has counted something incorrectly and paid people as though they'd won when they had in fact lost. As I'm clearly a horrible person, I don't say shit when this happens but simply chalk this up to being incredibly good luck.
    Elyscape and Lizard_King like this.
  5. Hanzii Magister Mundi Elyscape

    When that have happened to me, I'm usually convinced that I just missed something, or think that they've probably done the opposite just as many times without me noticing - if some lowly worker in a shop gives me the wrong change and I notice, I'll speak up, because I know they'll most likely get in trouble for it at days end.
    So while I'm sure the store can spare the money and most likely will fleece me at every opportunity, I feel sorry for the employee.
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  6. Reldan Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    At a casino, the dealer's best hope if they make an honest mistake that would cost the casino money is that the pit boss never finds out about it. Actively pointing out the error requires them to call the pit boss over and explain exactly how they screwed up, which doesn't score them any points. However, if I notice them make a mistake to underpay a player or take money they shouldn't take I'll point that out - the games are rigged against the player enough as-is without being compounded by human error.
    Elyscape, extarbags, ehm ecks and 2 others like this.
  7. UnSub Armchair Designer

    So I was reading this article and the following kind of came out of nowhere.

    I believe Mr Kuchera really, really, REALLY likes Predators.
  8. Talorc Worked The System

    Location:
    Perth
    So apparently pissy long form rants about as as good as your average "PC IS BETTER THAN CONSOLES YOU MORANS PLUS I WILL TOTALLY OWNZOR YOU WITH MY SUPERIOR MOUSE" forum post is now journalism. Fuck me, I didn't feel the "RPS has gone downhill" vibe before, but now I sure do. I am paid up member of the PC master race even (have not had a console in 15+ years) and it still looks like schoolboy juvenile stuff.

    http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/02/17/destiny-not-coming-to-pc-bungie-deny-reality/


    Then Ars technica chimed in:

    http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...keyboard-and-mouse-are-losing-the-fps-market/

    It's a actually fairly balanced tour of some available numbers (acknowledging any weaknesses of the sources), I didn't have a big issue with it (As ever DONT READ THE COMMENTS. The "editors pick" comment had some muppett saying he pulls out his mouse "when he wants to perform optimally". I think this means he can use it left handed)


    That of course trigged this 1500 word (!!) turgid rant in response. To be honest I couldn't read it all.

    http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/201...ill-a-major-player-in-fps-market/#more-142705

    I did get this far:

    DEAR JOHN, PLEASE FIND FOLLOWING A LIST OF THINGS THAT SOLD MORE THAN THE PS3 and X360:
    • PS2. More than both of them combined actually
    • PS1. From 1994.
    Nothing new happened with the PS3 and X360 mate.

    That is as far as I got, the rest is too confused and shite to even do more than skim read.

    I LIKED Kieron "fucking" Gillen. I think I'm going to have get into some marvel comics.

    Flare Path at least is reliably awesome each week.
  9. Adam B Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Minneapolis
    You know, it never fails to amuse me that Stern Defenders of Gaming Journalism always manage to post the most embarrassing screeds when they hold forth on What's Wrong With Writers Today.
    Elyscape and Kohei like this.
  10. Jamie Madigan Armchair Designer

    Here's a tip for all people who write about games: nobody who isn't one of you cares about your job nor wants to read about it. Naval gazing of this sort is only of interest to you.
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  11. Lizard_King Already Beat BF's New Expansion

    [IMG]
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  12. Jamie Madigan Armchair Designer

    Eh, looking at that now it came off harsher than it probably should have. Somebody is obviously into that stuff, but I personally can't figure out why. Nevermind.
  13. Lizard_King Already Beat BF's New Expansion

  14. Royal Fool I Pretty Much Live Here

    I don't think it was covered in this or the other thread, but last month Kotaku published an article about the divide between the east and west game developers. It's headline sparked a short twitter war between Kotaku and Hideki Kamiya of Platinum Games.

    However, it seems like Kotaku still bears a grudge. Apparently Metal Gear Rising is just too hard! Here, read our emails as we complain amongst ourselves about how awful this game is at teaching you stuff. This is also not the first time Kotaku has complained.

    I don't have a copy of the game to play but from what I can tell via youtube, you can perfectly parry or block every single attack from that Blade Wolf boss. The game even has him retreat several times and throws easy enemies at you so you can recharge your health. And from what I've read, the game does include a move list in-game that tells you which buttons to press to perform certain actions.
    Elyscape and extarbags like this.
  15. Adree Sangry Malcontent

    I couldn't really get a handle on parrying from the demo, but I only played through it once and gave up on the stupid wolf boss. It was certainly no Bayonetta.
  16. MartinL Level 90 Paladin

    Location:
    Paris
    Hello Ben Kuchera, meet cognitive dissonnance.

    I mean it's not as if he didn't write the same exact preview as anyone else when Activision asked him if he would kindly come to Seattle to hear PR talk about Bungie's next game.

    That (non) event, and the way everyone talked about it and gushed about it embodies what is wrong with the gaming press. Even if the reporters bitched because they didn't get enough information, Bungie got a lot of hype without showing anything except the wheels of their desks and a bit of concept art.

    The best part is that most of the important informations about Bungie next title were made public during the Activision / West-Zampella case 9-10 months ago. But it didn't get a lot of coverage then. Of course, it's easier to read PR than the LA Times.
  17. Hanzii Magister Mundi Elyscape

    Well, you confused him. Jack isn't actually In the navy.
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  18. quatoria Beardy Magnificence

  19. UnSub Armchair Designer

    I'd like to suggest if the problem is previews, then DON'T WRITE-UP PREVIEWS OF GAMES.

    Reading the article, the 'best' preview experiences are when Mr Kuchera gets to play a game before anyone else. The worst is where he has to watch someone else play a game and he can't.
    Elyscape and extarbags like this.
  20. Astromarine Elitist Negative Nancy

    This is an ENTIRE THREAD about their job. Methinks, protest, yadda yadda.
    Elyscape and Riztro like this.
  21. Hanzii Magister Mundi Elyscape

    EXCEPT THAT PREVIEWS ARE REALLY POPULAR WITH READERS.
    You know, those that pay the bill.
    Elyscape likes this.
  22. Zekedms Elitist Negative Nancy

    Previews are why I bought Colonial Marines.

    THE SYSTEM MUST BE OVERTHROWN.
    Elyscape and Hanzii like this.
  23. Hanzii Magister Mundi Elyscape

    I didn't say readers were intelligent, just that they liked previews.
    There's no money to be made from writing to intelligent gamers.
  24. Lizard_King Already Beat BF's New Expansion

    Not pictured: he's gazing at a navy.
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  25. UnSub Armchair Designer

    Then game writers need to shut up and accept that they are part of a massive consumerist industry designed to extract time and money that no-one gets back on experiences that aren't real and mostly have little to no redeeming value. Complaining that the preview content you got wasn't good enough so that you couldn't write an awesome article that drew eyeballs and encouraged hype for an unreleased, unproven title that gamers shouldn't pre-order because the games writer hasn't played it yet is tiresome wankery. Don't complain about PR when you are part of a giant PR-sponsored machine.

    I've been thinking that there are really only five types of games site items:

    1) Previews of unreleased content
    2) Reviews of just released content
    3) Post-release follow-ups on released content
    4) News
    5) General articles e.g. industry profiles, evaluation of events, editorial, etc.

    (Happy for anyone to add to this, but let's ignore tone / style such as rants versus factual accounts versus everything in-between.)

    Yes, previews are popular and attract eyeballs, but they are a big part of the reason gaming "journalism" has such a terrible reputation.
    Elyscape likes this.
  26. Charles Despondent Fancybear

    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    I'd pay money to subscribe to a site that had true investigative journalism about the game industry.
  27. Adam B Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Minneapolis
    No offense, Charles, but you and like twenty other people. I'll forgive the VC funding for not jumping all over the Serious Investigative Reporting about Games startups.

    (More seriously: The problem is that what people want when they say "investigative journalism" tends to be "get interviews with people inside the industry, on-record, saying mean things about their companies/competitors/products" and/or "report numbers about what is and isn't selling at what price points and which platforms." Both of those things are basically impossible to obtain. The best that you tend to get are things like the recent [excellent] Eurogamer piece on gun licensing, in which the reporter reports on how he was 100% stonewalled by every gaming company he approached and had all of his info from other sources like politicians and gun manufacturers.)

    On the previews topic, despite my drive-by linksnarking yesterday I do sympathize with the disgust at the preview hype machine. You know what, though? People will happily read (well, click on anyway) previews with whateverthefuck text you write as long as you've got some screenshots in there. Sure, sometimes they're bullshots. Blame PR, and write about it if you feel it's necessary. But there's tons and tons and tons of room to take a critical eye to preview materials and write about it if you're any actual damn good at your job.

    Seriously. It's, like, super fucking easy to not hyperventilate about the top-line bullet points on the onesheet. Hell, it's entirely possible to go to a studio in another country, see their game for the first time ever and do a bunch of interviews with the dev team, and write a 12-page preview talking about the game without giving one sloppy handski in the text.

    Now, some people want to see writers tear pre-release games apart for every little thing. I shouldn't have to explain why games that aren't fucking done yet get a whole lot more benefit of the doubt than products being actually reviewed. But I don't think that's what youse guys in this thread are asking for.

    Anyway, rant off.

    tl;dr -- writing good previews is not that hard. Promise.
    Keldroc, quatoria, Marcin and 11 others like this.
  28. Jamie Madigan Armchair Designer

    I think a related problem is that there probably aren't that many stories that would fit the investigative journalism mold if you want to limit it to games. There's only so much to investigate and I doubt you could update daily or even weekly with that kind of content. That said, I would totally donate to a kind of scholarship or foundation that earmarked a salary for someone to do this kind of investigative journalism and put out something say once a month (or more, depending) even if it's not bringing in as much ad revenue as other content.
    Hanzii and Adam B like this.
  29. Astromarine Elitist Negative Nancy

    You're saying the *exact same thing* that Kuchera said in his piece. Report on things, but be comprehensive and honest. If PR won't let you touch a game, take your own scerenshots, or answer questions report on that as well. But otherwise Previews as a whole are a net good and people shouldn't swear off them.

    So, is there some deep nuance of meaning that I'm not getting which explains why you snarked all over a guy saying the exact thing you did, or did you see the Kuchera name and your knee jerked all over your keyboard and pressed post reply?
    Charles, Zekedms and Elyscape like this.
  30. Adam B Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Minneapolis
    See if you can detect a difference in tone between Kuchera's breathless earnestness and my post, Astromarine.

    That stuff is out there. The better outlets -- Eurogamer, Gamasutra/Game Developer, Gamespot, Polygon (there are so very many things that make my teeth itch about Polygon but they run some good features for sure), hell even us -- run those kinds of pieces from time to time.

    And then they get 20k views and die on the vine. But we do them anyway, because believe it or not people who do this professionally would in fact rather write about interesting, deeper topics from time to time rather than how gosh darn pretty them thar Crysis trees are.
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  31. Footmunch Oh, Come On

    Location:
    UK
    If the worth of an article is the page views it gets, then no one should be surprised at the game journalism we have.
    UnSub, Zekedms and Elyscape like this.
  32. MartinL Level 90 Paladin

    Location:
    Paris
    In fact I was wrong (or pretty bad at googling). I checked a bit and the information on Destiny came out on most major sites, althought I'm pretty sure it didn't generate a whole lot of comment. The raw info was there, but the followup wasn't.
    Elyscape likes this.
  33. Hanzii Magister Mundi Elyscape

    There's a reason even traditional media is moving further and further from the investigative journalism, even though it's still what they praise and talk about when giving out prices or (over here) explaining to politicians why they're important to society and need tax breaks - it's expensive and time consuming and sometimes dead ends after weeks of work... and the majority of readers don't care. Certainly not enough to pay.

    Investigative journalism only about gaming would be severely limited in scope.
    Zekedms, cuc, Elyscape and 1 other person like this.
  34. pallas Roughly Touched

    Investigative journalism in gaming would be a blog pointing out obvious acts of collusion and malfeasance. Since indepth investigations would violate some NDAs.



    After the colonial marines debacle... I'm starting to regret buying SimCity 5 based on previews.
    Elyscape likes this.
  35. Adam B Keeper of the Elemental Materials

    Location:
    Minneapolis
    That makes sense. Gearbox and Sega have a lot to do with SimCity.
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  36. pallas Roughly Touched

    This is a thread about industry wide issues and you suddenly assume we're just talking about one game?
  37. Elyscape Already Beat BF's New Expansion

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    ?????
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  38. Talorc Worked The System

    Location:
    Perth
    This is not a "gaming" journalist only issue. Surprising numbers of mainstream journalists manage to bore the world shitless with their endless fundament gazing brought upon by the wholesale smashing of their industry structure.

    Mainstream investigative journalism is basically on life support. How many times does even stuff like the New York Times etc get a genuine "investigative" story up? Couple of times a year tops? (NOTE: Getting a drop from some PR person that wanted to give you the materiel does not count as "investigative" journalism) Game journalism has no hope.
    Zekedms and Elyscape like this.
  39. Charles Despondent Fancybear

    Location:
    Toronto, ON
    Maybe that's what clueless people want. Me, I want to looks into how companies run, roots behind controversies, why some games go south, why people leave companies, what kind of deals publishers force on developers, what kind of restrictions console makers force on devs, etc. There are a lot of things that happen in the game industry that no one talks about, or that is hidden behind secretive contracts, that I would love to see outed so that people were more aware of what goes on.

    Sure, it wouldn't be enough to populate an entire news source, but a site that actually did that kind of thing would likely have better all around reporting to begin with. I'd even be happy with a news source that was overtly critical of the gaming press at large, and doing meta-journalism while digging into things.

    I guess the best I have right now is PAR, which is okay, but still has some serious issues, not the least of which is that it's largely driven by Ben Kuchera's questionable ego, but also that you cannot trust them when you talk to them; they are perfectly willing to talk to you and then take something you said in confidence or off the record and publish it, attributed to you. Which isn't really a good habit for a respectable outfit to have, especially not one that is attempting to do journalism.

    Basically I guess what I'm saying here is that I wish NYT or some real journalism source would spend a bit more time looking into games.
    Zekedms, cuc, Not One Of Us and 5 others like this.
  40. Equis Armchair Designer

    Does Game Developer Magazine do that somewhat?

    In anycase, I'm with you in wanting to read that, but also pretty sure few developers will actually talk about the stuff that goes behind closed doors. There's a whole veil of secrecy around most game development projects, not completely unearned, but bordering on super -secret science projects type behaviour. Protecting the hype as it were. Even post-mortems tend to paper over the worse of production excesses and mistakes, or exaggerate aspects that memory and nostalgia bring about.

    Who'd talk to this journalists though? and still keep working in the industry. Most other companies employment is fluid enough as it is without somehow jeopardizing your career path by saying something you shouldn't have to someone you shouldn't have to piss off someone's ego in some place you might have wanted to work.
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